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Post by Severla on Mar 15, 2019 20:19:05 GMT
I doubt this is of any help but Trish Status was rated something like 28 & Stacey Kiebler even less in past Fire Pros Trish was based on being a manager/during the start of her wrestling career and not her later years (considering it was Fire Pro Z in '03). Lita had already had some high-action moments and was known for having trained in Mexico and was rated much higher for it. I also do agree with Ares on the fact that some points are clearly weighted harder. Agility is on like 50%+ of moves and so Agility/Impact are indeed extremely heavily weighted. |
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Post by FlashBurton on Mar 16, 2019 11:40:18 GMT
Yeah, Lita was way more respectable 90's range with Chyna in the high 90's, who was wrestling guys in Japan at this point. Like I said, take the Fire Pro ratings with a pinch of salt
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Post by DM_PSX on Mar 17, 2019 0:43:23 GMT
Yeah, Lita was way more respectable 90's range with Chyna in the high 90's, who was wrestling guys in Japan at this point. Like I said, take the Fire Pro ratings with a pinch of salt The final number is completely meaningless to me. Just go over each stat one by one, and be honest (With regards to how good they are / how much they use it). I have an old guy who has 1 for everything and full punch. He spends the match barely moving and stalling out with weak subs etc, and dozing off. Then he punches you to death. He has like maybe 20-30 points with his movement skills and all that mixed in. He still murders people. Also, those 20-90 point spreads in FPW GBA are for people who aren't logic'd out to 'work' matches, and it predates UKEMI. Changing your UKEMI around has more of an effect on the match then your point difference. |
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Post by heelsinc on Mar 17, 2019 12:04:27 GMT
When talking about parameters I always like to point out that you could potential have say a 30 point edit still beat a much higher point edit if say the 30 pointer has 10 in his kick offense and ONLY does kicks. So a guy like Tajiri who you would probably want to give a high kick stat to could end up murdering people because he would have a very kick heavy offense.
My way of doing parameters is to to it after building the moveset so I can see what moves go with what paramerers. It's not nearly as simple as a guy having a high throw because he's awesome at that but also how many throw moves he has and how often he does them.
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Post by heelsinc on Mar 18, 2019 14:21:49 GMT
. I think they gave Kurt Angle like an 8 power - that's up into "hoss" territory, really large heavyweights - and Kurt hardly even does any "power" moves! I'm guessing they were just trying to "buff" him a bit from his FPD stats, but they'd have been better served to add a point to the categories he uses (Suplex, Joint, Agility) and a couple points to Impact - you keep his identity, strengths and weaknesses, intact, you just have a stronger version of himself. [/div][/quote] Theres not really anything wrong with this though if theres an edit that does 1 move in the power category they wouldn't be know as a big power guy but there's nothing wrong with giving that guy a 10 if you want that one move to be super impactful. |
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Post by IamAres on Mar 18, 2019 18:19:23 GMT
Doesn't make any grand-scheme sense. The whole point of having different stats for different abilities is so you can reflect different strengths and weaknesses and give guys some identity. If a guy is 230 pounds, I don't believe for a second he does power moves as forcefully as a 400-pound monster. And what move would they have been trying to do this on with Kurt Angle? A backbreaker? It's just sloppy.
I'm not saying you can never, EVER do this...I did something like what you're saying on my FPR Dean Malenko because they made the cloverleaf use Arm Power as a primary stat. So I cranked his Arm Power up to unrealistic levels to make the move function, and made sure he used it on few to no moves besides the cloverleaf. (In FPW, I just switched what parameters it uses...and then we got the new cloverleaf anyway.) But in probably 99 cases out of 100 I don't find it ideal. And this was done in the stats for the GBA games a fair bit, and not even done to boost a key move, just...a sloppy way to buff guys.
GBA Games. Grain of salt.
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Post by Recall on Mar 18, 2019 21:04:26 GMT
Defence stats are usually very wrong on hardcore wrestlers. Their rough needs to be the same for both attack and defence.
Abdullah Kobayashi can dish out a shit load of damage and absorb it too. Jun Kasai, Masashi Takeda, Jaki Numazawa, Isami Kodaka, Yuko Miyamoto, Ryuji Ito ai etc etc all have deathmatches that last as long as regular wrestling matches so in things like barbed wire matches that rough defence needs to correctly set.
Unless that stat has zero impact on match types??
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Post by LankyLefty17 on Mar 18, 2019 21:27:38 GMT
Defence stats are usually very wrong on hardcore wrestlers. Their rough needs to be the same for both attack and defence. Abdullah Kobayashi can dish out a shit load of damage and absorb it too. Jun Kasai, Masashi Takeda, Jaki Numazawa, Isami Kodaka, Yuko Miyamoto, Ryuji Ito ai etc etc all have deathmatches that last as long as regular wrestling matches so in things like barbed wire matches that rough defence needs to correctly set. Unless that stat has zero impact on match types?? Defensive stats are purely the amount of damage a wrestler takes when a move with that identifier is used against them. So, rough defense means that if a move with Rough offense is used they will take less damage the higher you set the value to. Thats it- it has nothing to do with match type. Also keep in mind the offensive to defensive parameter names dont line up 1-1 because Spike is Spike.
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Post by OrochiGeese on Mar 18, 2019 21:52:56 GMT
I'm not sure that there is any defensive parameter that allows a wrestler to take less damage from weapons. The best thing you can do to help wrestlers in Hardcore matches in regards to weapons is to have the two skills below. But the effect of that last skill is worded somewhat unclear. It seems to mean that there are specific parameters that govern weapon usage and weapon resiliency which hardcore skill adds +3 to.
That all being said, I'm much more certain that there isn't a parameter or skill that controls or reduces damage that you take from non-wrestler hazards like the audience barrier, cage, barbed wire, or land mines.
In general, having high recovery would probably just help you out. It wouldn't cut down on the damage absorbed from attacks related to those items, but it would somewhat nullify it by giving you HP back quicker.
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Post by TheDenizen on Mar 18, 2019 22:38:49 GMT
you can also give a guy who's supposed to be a hardcore maniac better recovery/spirit when bleeding than when not bleeding. I usually avoid doing this as it seems counter intuitive, but this is the one situation where I'd say it's acceptable.
Doesn't make him take less damage against weapons shots, but he'll recover his HP faster if he's already busted open.
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Post by IamAres on Mar 18, 2019 23:46:01 GMT
Geese, weapon swings use rough attack/defense for their damage (for the most part;IIRC, a few of them use power as a secondary offense) and they're basically like standing strikes that you have to be holding them to do.
Deni, the stats for breathing and recovery are weighted a little bit (towards bleeding being debilitating), so they're still lower when you're bleeding even if they're equal. I think the highest rank of breathing-while-bleeding is actually equivalent breath recovery to the lowest rank of regular breathing.
Spirit is not weighted like this, so a guy with the same in both will not lose any spirit recovery for bleeding-or can actually gain if you have him set up like that. Like, he gets pissed instead of discouraged that he's wounded.
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Post by TheDenizen on Mar 19, 2019 0:03:33 GMT
cool info, thanks :D
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Post by OrochiGeese on Mar 19, 2019 3:28:16 GMT
Geese, weapon swings use rough attack/defense for their damage (for the most part;IIRC, a few of them use power as a secondary offense) and they're basically like standing strikes that you have to be holding them to do. Thanks! Very good to know! 💡 Definitely makes sense as well. So those are the parameters affected by the Hardcore special skill. I'm guessing that skill only boosts those parameters when a weapon is being held. |
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Post by IamAres on Mar 19, 2019 5:33:21 GMT
Just took a look through the handy-dandy FPR Move Data and I was partially correct; most weapon swings are Rough/ARM Power. The barbed-wire bat is straight rough, the singapore cane and light tube are rough/tech. Defenses for all are Rough/Impact, except the barbed-wire bat is, again, straight rough.
The chair causes the most base damage, though they're all in the same ballpark, more or less; the light tube, however, does significantly more spirit damage. It also has by far the highest bleed chance (20% on an overhead swing), with the barbed wire bat having about half what it does, and the rest having about a quarter of THAT. Suffice to say, the light tube would make matches real short if it didn't break with one hard swing.
The more you know...about beating up wrestlers with weapons.
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Post by OrochiGeese on Mar 19, 2019 5:54:20 GMT
That's really helpful information! 💡
I'm not surprised that the light tube does so much damage, but I am surprised it does so much spirit damage AND has twice the probability of blood than the barbed wire bat. I figured they were roughly equivalent with blood likelihood. I mean, a barbed wire bat isn't exactly silly putty!
The fact that weapons usage relies on different parameters depending on the specific weapon makes the language in the "Hardcore" special skill a lot clearer to me now too.
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