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Post by dnmt on Sept 4, 2018 6:38:28 GMT
So I am working a lot on my CPU Logic and Priorities and Movesets but still feel like I could improve the way the early part of the match goes.
What do you think is the best way to simulate some early chain wrestling? Are there specific Priority chains or aspects of Logic I need to focus on? Particular moves that transition well into other moves? Any tips on how to generally get more realistic early parts of a match is appreciated.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2018 6:53:06 GMT
Drop Toehold / Headlock Takedown / Armdrag into Running Shoulderblock is a great one that came out of the Priority Combo thread. You can also chain one of those early match takedowns into the rear chinlock or some other basic submission hold on the ground.
BTW, I *love* that we now have the ability to link into running moves and enough slots to include things like this.
OH also, the running counter move "La Esparda" is a chain-wrestling sequence into a backslide.
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Post by invader3k on Sept 4, 2018 12:44:11 GMT
I give most of my Edits, when appropriate, the back switch, as both a grapple move and as a counter. It can lead to some nice hold/counter-hold wrestling.
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Post by webbhead1584 on Sept 4, 2018 14:33:33 GMT
So I am working a lot on my CPU Logic and Priorities and Movesets but still feel like I could improve the way the early part of the match goes. What do you think is the best way to simulate some early chain wrestling? Are there specific Priority chains or aspects of Logic I need to focus on? Particular moves that transition well into other moves? Any tips on how to generally get more realistic early parts of a match is appreciated. have you added this set up to your edits of kenny and the rest ? If so does that not take away from what's already there ?
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Post by dnmt on Sept 4, 2018 15:42:38 GMT
So I am working a lot on my CPU Logic and Priorities and Movesets but still feel like I could improve the way the early part of the match goes. What do you think is the best way to simulate some early chain wrestling? Are there specific Priority chains or aspects of Logic I need to focus on? Particular moves that transition well into other moves? Any tips on how to generally get more realistic early parts of a match is appreciated. have you added this set up to your edits of kenny and the rest ? If so does that not take away from what's already there ? I am still working on it. These edits are a permanent work in progress as they are going to change every time I see the guy do a new move or get a new attire. So after the Destruction Tour, I am probably going to update anyone who needs it. You don't need to worry as you just get the updates automatically when you sign on PS4 anyway. But yes, I've added part of it but am always looking to refine and improve them.
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Post by view619 on Sept 4, 2018 16:40:22 GMT
So I am working a lot on my CPU Logic and Priorities and Movesets but still feel like I could improve the way the early part of the match goes. What do you think is the best way to simulate some early chain wrestling? Are there specific Priority chains or aspects of Logic I need to focus on? Particular moves that transition well into other moves? Any tips on how to generally get more realistic early parts of a match is appreciated. Reducing the number of moves that knockdown early in a match, and setting up priorities out of basic moves that do knockdown helps a lot. It's easier to simulate the early wear down period when wrestlers aren't being tossed around within the first three minutes. Also, liberal use of the back switch into basic knockdown moves and ground transistions. Back switch, leg trip and back mount as one sequence can work very well for chain wrestling.
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Post by Severla on Sept 4, 2018 16:55:53 GMT
My current thing I've been adding to most of my edits is an early-game standing stun move (like Toe Kick B, etc) then setting the SmallDamage category in 'Opponent Dazed' to be one of the heavy strikes (like upwards of 50%), or potentially a Flying Pin or Armbreaker for lucha/sub edits. I just drastically drop (if not flatly remove) those move %s in the Medium category.
This gives WAY better use of your Big-Move strikes throughout a match, as many of them are too long of animations to hit non-dazed and you dont really want them active in Critical category (unless they are strike finishers). It also 'expands your moveset' a bit seeing as you can set one to fire heavily at Small then have the other two equally rise in the LargeDamage category.
So, using my updated Chris Severla edit as example, Sev will tend to Fierce Chop if he Toe Kicks you at Small. Once he hits Large, the chop notably lessens but his Enziguri shoots up and gives it a much more 'bigger move' feeling. His 3rd Heavy Strike is a 'Big Boot' Front Kick, which stays at flat use at Small/Medium as a 'filler' move. At Critical his strikes basically vanish in stun because he has a Back Finisher and he'll instead often go for that.
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Post by mbxfilms on Sept 4, 2018 17:53:26 GMT
I do headlock to running shoulder block in priority. The new headlocks they added are great for it. Or very high whip rate and very high duck down or leap frog chance also.
Snapmare to chinlock or another hold.
AND PINS. A quick move and pin even when it's no count. Looks like they are trying to win. Plus that attacks the spirit of the opponent early.
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Post by dnmt on Sept 4, 2018 19:14:07 GMT
So I am working a lot on my CPU Logic and Priorities and Movesets but still feel like I could improve the way the early part of the match goes. What do you think is the best way to simulate some early chain wrestling? Are there specific Priority chains or aspects of Logic I need to focus on? Particular moves that transition well into other moves? Any tips on how to generally get more realistic early parts of a match is appreciated. Reducing the number of moves that knockdown early in a match, and setting up priorities out of basic moves that do knockdown helps a lot. It's easier to simulate the early wear down period when wrestlers aren't being tossed around within the first three minutes. Also, liberal use of the back switch into basic knockdown moves and ground transistions. Back switch, leg trip and back mount as one sequence can work very well for chain wrestling. I heard the MMA back mount can be hard to use as it does a ton of spirit damage to non-MMA guys? It was outlined by Severla in a thread somewhere. Otherwise this is great info.
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Post by Severla on Sept 4, 2018 19:49:20 GMT
If heavily spammed, they can cause some unwarranted things, yes.
Set em to lower use and in Small only and it's probably not so bad.
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Post by view619 on Sept 4, 2018 20:26:10 GMT
Reducing the number of moves that knockdown early in a match, and setting up priorities out of basic moves that do knockdown helps a lot. It's easier to simulate the early wear down period when wrestlers aren't being tossed around within the first three minutes. Also, liberal use of the back switch into basic knockdown moves and ground transistions. Back switch, leg trip and back mount as one sequence can work very well for chain wrestling. I heard the MMA back mount can be hard to use as it does a ton of spirit damage to non-MMA guys? It was outlined by Severla in a thread somewhere. Otherwise this is great info. They're like any other move, ensure your guys have decent technical/MMA defense, don't spam the mounts and they work fine. Mounts are only an issue in a wrestling match when they're being used often throughout the entire match; controlled properly they're fine. If you want to use them strictly for chain wrestling, then restrict their usage to small and only use moves that fit the early stages of the match; no piledrivers or bash counters.
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Post by Spunk on Sept 4, 2018 20:33:59 GMT
I feel like this is like everything else in Fire Pro, where with logic you can do a pretty good job.
When I make edits I tend to err on the side of very, very high logic for standing weak strikes that don't down an opponent and weaker holds. The MMA positions are good and all, but the spirit damage can really drag matches down if you don't know what you're doing with it or overuse them. They should not, for example, be used to expand your moveset.
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Post by view619 on Sept 4, 2018 22:08:32 GMT
For what it's worth, Back Switch also does spirit damage equal to the MMA mounts (all do 7 damage across the board, while I'm assuming the counter does 14). So, it's really down to controlled use of all the technical moves, as well as proper offensive and defensive parameter allocation if you actually do want to use them often.
I'm assuming that the idea behind this is that you're rewarded for executing the transitional move, but since you have multiple options to choose from while the opponent is limited to one their counter does "decent" damage as well. Probably to balance out the amount of damage you would get from the transition & successful move.
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Post by Severla on Sept 4, 2018 23:05:22 GMT
For what it's worth, Back Switch also does spirit damage equal to the MMA mounts I'm 90% sure they made Back Switch (or it already was) an MMA Transition. A) It's reversal rate is amusingly high (edit: the move following it is* not the switch itself) B) There are Back Grapples that are directly MMA-related (such as back punches, takedowns, and mount-transitions)** **Back Switch opens up the Back Grap to MMA styles as 'Pick Up Opponent' should, in all reality, NEVER be used in the MMA ruleset. Prior to World, very few moves stunned standing opponents. They've been increased heavily, but before that Small Stun practically never existed for MMA to Stun -> Walk to Back.
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