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Post by Recall on Oct 21, 2019 11:47:09 GMT
So as a test I used the default edit, John Smith and gated off the grapples so he only used Elbow Butt 100% for small grapples, snap suplex 100% for medium grapples and a super kick at 100% for large.
Every single time the match went as follows. Elbow Butt for the opening 90 seconds, then snap suplexes until the in game timer hit about 2 mins 50 and then all the game did was super kicks for 13 more minutes before the match was over.
Stats are 4 across the board for both defence and offence and the window in which the game considers the match to be in the large range is so fast that almost the entire moveset is redundant.
This was an issue first introduced in Returns where []+X moves were never countered and would always hit at any point after the 3 minute mark. Same applies for World.
Is there any way to stop this? Is it solely down to Ukemi? The game moves too fast in regards to how quickly large moves can be hit without hindrance.
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Post by adwhizz on Oct 21, 2019 14:28:32 GMT
I would think the defense parameters of the opponent plays a large part of how fast they get to med/large damage
The higher their defense the slower it should take
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Post by DM_PSX on Oct 21, 2019 15:30:03 GMT
Yep. I left all my lucha fed guys on 4 and the matches are 5-10 minutes.
Someone did a nice spreadsheet not long ago.
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Post by Recall on Oct 21, 2019 15:45:27 GMT
The match went to 17 minutes, but 13 minutes of it were just large damage moves.
The mid damage range only seems to last about 3 grapples before pushing in to the large damage range.
The game seems to always rush to the end.
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Post by DM_PSX on Oct 21, 2019 15:50:17 GMT
The match went to 17 minutes, but 13 minutes of it were just large damage moves. The mid damage range only seems to last about 3 grapples before pushing in to the large damage range. The game seems to always rush to the end. It's been said before that the medium damage range has the smallest threshold. It's normal. Your damage tier moves are spread out by actual damage, not evenly across the time of the match. Post your grapple logic as a screenshot. |
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Post by Recall on Oct 21, 2019 15:59:48 GMT
I pick one small damage move, make it 100% everything else 0. Same for med. same for large.
The game hits large damage moves once the in game timer 3:45 regardless of defence of the opponent. It’s gated, it’s very clear to see.
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Post by Dawnbr3ak3r on Oct 21, 2019 16:31:35 GMT
I pick one small damage move, make it 100% everything else 0. Same for med. same for large. The game hits large damage moves once the in game timer 3:45 regardless of defence of the opponent. It’s gated, it’s very clear to see. You don't understand. Moves have their own damage settings baked into them. A Toe Kick does a different amount of damage than some of the other Shoot-based kicks. The Muay Thai Kicks hit the hardest of all, iirc. Also, the damage is not gated. I've had the Medium Damage phase last anywhere between 4 and 15 minutes (or longer) on more than a few occasions, depending on who is involved, more commonly with Flash Pin or Submission-heavy edits. I've also had a match last literally 283 real-time minutes. I'm pretty sure I know what I'm talking about. Since I'm here and wasted most of my morning on this: You're very vague in regards to what settings you're using if you're somehow getting 15+ minute matches when I ran it over 30 times and only once did a match get remotely close to or go over 15 minutes. Every other match was 11 minutes or less, with the majority of matches ending in 6 to 8 minutes. Elbows at 100% Small/Snap Suplex 100% Medium/Superkick in the SML + MED slot at 100% ~ Large Moves don't get countered as often in Late match/Large Damage. Large Damage moves will be countered more often in Small/Early and Medium/Middle phases. I even deliberately zeroed out other Logic settings and the majority of matches still only lasted 6 to 8 minutes on average. Ukemi doesn't guarantee a counter will happen. Ukemi dictates how much a wrestler will sell for an opponent, and allows a wrestler to take a certain amount of damage that may yield a large portion of Spirit return, depending on how high or low the Ukemi setting is. The lower the setting, the less Spirit returned. A 0/0/0 edit won't be able to generate much of any Spirit when they escape a submission or pinfall attempt. Conversely, an edit with High Ukemi will, but may not be able to kick out because of the damage sustained. I've got a few 20/100/50 edits who take most of the beating in the middle and late phases, who generate plenty of Spirit, but still lose in the end anyways. |
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Post by LankyLefty17 on Oct 21, 2019 16:42:05 GMT
Everything Dawn said.
But also, I run most of my matches with the health bars on (mods) and in a given match two edits will work through the damage phases at different paces depending on everything Dawn laid out. If you're on PC turning those on will actually help visualize whats happening if you're really curious, but there's definitely not any time based gating going on. And it definitely isn't at 3:45 (most of my edits large damage moves start showing up around 8-10 game minutes by design).
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Post by Senator Phillips on Oct 21, 2019 16:43:21 GMT
Not going into the depth that Dawn did, because that was comprehensive enough, but I can certainly confirm that there isn't some time based gating on the damage phases.
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Post by Spunk on Oct 24, 2019 7:53:59 GMT
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