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Post by crippler19 on Aug 25, 2019 0:59:44 GMT
For those that follow Stardom closely, have you noticed any glaring moveset issues?
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Post by sonny615 on Aug 25, 2019 8:59:40 GMT
For those that follow Stardom closely, have you noticed any glaring moveset issues? I started following Stardom closely *after* the DLC so can't say I've noticed anything major. Kagetsu seems to be using the Chickenwing Arm Lock variation in every match so I gave her that. Also replaced her 2nd Rope Superplex with the Avalanche Backflip, since she is using this Fireman's Carry Slam from the turnbuckle. What I did notice is that they gave her male small 2 in her waist, while the rest of her body is 3. I must admit that I did a similar mistake with one of my edits (thank crippler for pointing it out) but I'm also not charging money for my edits :)
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Kris
JIM MINY
www.twitch.tv/purist_chris
Posts: 79
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Post by Kris on Aug 25, 2019 12:52:21 GMT
I'm imagining DJKM weeping with sweet joy at the edit patch update.
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Post by Dawnbr3ak3r on Aug 25, 2019 13:13:12 GMT
Also replaced her 2nd Rope Superplex with the Avalanche Backflip, since she is using this Fireman's Carry Slam from the turnbuckle. What I did notice is that they gave her male small 2 in her waist, while the rest of her body is 3. I must admit that I did a similar mistake with one of my edits (thank crippler for pointing it out) but I'm also not charging money for my edits :) That's actually her Ebisu Drop; She does the same thing as a Standing Grapple - It's more or less the same as the Hurricane Driver in the game. I noticed the botch with her waist too. Can probably mention that in a bug fix post or something.
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Post by crippler19 on Aug 25, 2019 14:19:01 GMT
For those that follow Stardom closely, have you noticed any glaring moveset issues? I started following Stardom closely *after* the DLC so can't say I've noticed anything major. Kagetsu seems to be using the Chickenwing Arm Lock variation in every match so I gave her that. Also replaced her 2nd Rope Superplex with the Avalanche Backflip, since she is using this Fireman's Carry Slam from the turnbuckle. What I did notice is that they gave her male small 2 in her waist, while the rest of her body is 3. I must admit that I did a similar mistake with one of my edits (thank crippler for pointing it out) but I'm also not charging money for my edits :) The Edits you’ve posted looked great, gonna be checking them out more today hopefully.
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Post by IamAres on Aug 25, 2019 18:43:32 GMT
Yeah, I haven't downloaded any, but I keep an eye on Sonny's stuff, and his attention to detail is fantastic. I have to take different tacks with my guys (or not study his stuff too much) or I'll end up stealing it lol.
As far as the parameters go, I've gone and lowered every parameter by two (and the power and arm power by three, because those seem extra high) and it seems to be a good starting point. Their matches with each other are still about the same, and they're MUCH closer to being in-scale with my existing edits. I had my altered Hana fight Manami Toyota (whose params I've raised UP from her "official" incarnation) and Toyota barely squeaked a win out in an even match, so they're still plenty strong at these levels. I'll test further before I tweak further, of course, but it seems to be a good starting point.
I left their skills untouched, because they seem to play well into the generally offense-heavy joshi style, along with the fairly high ukemi they have. I've been watching a lot of older joshi lately and I've been steering my own edits the same way, so that works out well; they seem have reached a similar conclusion.
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Post by OrochiGeese on Aug 25, 2019 19:42:47 GMT
Found the first potential casualty to report: post-match, Taunt 4 priorities (to mimic the heel shit) is busted for grapples. Taunts, Running, and Top Rope still fire (even if the running and top rope dont go off, they move into position), but Flip and the Head/Feet dont work. Edit: put a technical post on Steam since that's all I'm directly capable of. Good find there 💡 Just to clarify, which grapples are you referring to? Front, back, down? Are you saying that priorities coming from grapples into taunt 4 are broken? Or are you using the mod to priority taunts into grapples somehow? Or do you mean Taunt 4 into ground moves are broken?
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Post by Severla on Aug 25, 2019 19:49:08 GMT
Just to clarify, which grapples are you referring to? Front, back, down? Are you saying that priorities coming from grapples into taunt 4 are broken? Or are you using the mod to priority taunts into grapples somehow? Or do you mean Taunt 4 into ground moves are broken? Taunt 4 into ground moves, basically. Tried to verbally separate them from running/dives/etc because those could still be seen as 'grounded moves.' Didnt mean to suggest actual grapples. Whoops! No mods on this one (although if they dont fix it, Carl's Heel mod will be literally the only way for post match beat-downs now).
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Post by OrochiGeese on Aug 25, 2019 20:20:52 GMT
Taunt 4 into ground moves, basically. Tried to verbally separate them from running/dives/etc because those could still be seen as 'grounded moves.' Didnt mean to suggest actual grapples. Whoops! Thanks for the clarification! 😎 I modified a taunt order last night just to make use of post-match priorities into grounded moves! 😁😭 No mods on this one (although if they dont fix it, Carl's Heel mod will be literally the only way for post match beat-downs now). Yeah, and I can see that happening too. I kind of feel like the post-match priorities were a happy accident that Spike never intended to begin with and they were waiting to get rid of them (either intentionally or accidentally, LOL), sort of like doing moves in the corner of death matches.
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Post by sonny615 on Aug 27, 2019 8:46:39 GMT
I've seen quite a few members of the community not happy with the DLC (be it price, little content, bad point system and what not), while other blindly defend Spike (because Fire Pro). After spending quite a lot of time with the DLC in recent days (my workshop page serves as proof lol), here's my two cents in a very subjective review. Let me start off by saying that the more I play it, the more I love this DLC.
Before I explain why, let’s get the negatives out of the way (and there are quite a few, be patient!):
* The DLC is clearly overpriced; both in gaming industry standards (in other games we get full expansions for that kind of money ) and in the standard that Spike themselves set in previous DLC (no belts, referees, no story & only 10 wrestlers with only 1 attire each – that is the definition of bare bones).
* The point system given to the edits seems disconnected from previous Fire Pro entries, making the current edits ‘overpowered’ compared to the rest.
Surely, one can say that Spike intended Stardom to be in its own universe, so the ranking system is not related to anything else. I tend to disagree and think that’s just sloppy work. Just like a Football Manager game wouldn’t make the Australian League second division super strong compared to the Premier League (“because they are in completely different leagues and never play with each other”), I would expect Spike to continue its multi year tradition and keep the edit points in the same standard.
* The sloppiness continues with the edits themselves – some parts are clearly off (for example – Kagetsu has one of her body parts in a different tone than the rest of her body) and some logic decisions are questionable (going for strong moves early in the match). Although, to be fair, these issues aren’t common and Spike has a history of making bad logic so in a way this does keep the tradition going :)
With so many cons, why do I like this DLC so much?
Well, one of the things I loved the most about older Fire Pro games was the sense of discovery. I recall playing Super Fire Pro Wrestling X Premium and asking myself – who is that guy in the green trunks that keeps beating everyone with his elbows? That’s how I discovered Mitsuharu Misawa and that’s how I discovered Puroresu. Playing the game and then watching & discovering the wrestler or promotion in real life was a really fun experience for me and then the other way around, watching someone in real life and then making him in Fire Pro.
Playing the game (and by playing I mean editing/creating & simming) and watching wrestling became so synonymous to me that I literally can’t watch a wrestling show if Fire Pro isn’t turned on on another screen and if it’s not, I find myself thinking “how do I make this guy in the game?” or if I already made him, I think “is his moveset accurate?”.
I never cared about STARDOM and probably wouldn’t if not for this DLC. I looked into it a short time before the DLC was released and I was hooked. I can gladly say that to me, this DLC provided that same sense of discovery I experienced with the early Fire Pro games and that alone gives me so much more value than all those negatives I talked about at the start of this review.
Personally, I recreate all official edits anyway and add my own touch and tweaks to them so having points a little higher than I would like is just another thing for me to mess around with while watching the STARDOM 5* Grand Prix in the background :)
This editing & recreation (and later, creation of new stuff) is, in my eyes, as essential and fun part of Fire Pro as the simming itself and I am grateful to Spike for releasing this DLC, giving me that old sense of discovery, inspiration and many hours of fun, while also getting a chance to support my favorite game and women wrestling in the process.
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Post by kip1985 on Aug 27, 2019 13:19:24 GMT
I'm imagining DJKM weeping with sweet joy at the edit patch update. It's too bad his game is messed up. He hasn't uploaded anything in over a month or so since he can't get into the menus without his game freezing on him.
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Kris
JIM MINY
www.twitch.tv/purist_chris
Posts: 79
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Post by Kris on Aug 27, 2019 20:47:05 GMT
I'm imagining DJKM weeping with sweet joy at the edit patch update. It's too bad his game is messed up. He hasn't uploaded anything in over a month or so since he can't get into the menus without his game freezing on him. That is a shame. I've not been on the workshop for a while so I never realised. I hope he gets sorted soon. On the plus side I imagine he has a lot more free time on his hands now.
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Post by faulknasty on Aug 28, 2019 0:24:08 GMT
I've seen quite a few members of the community not happy with the DLC (be it price, little content, bad point system and what not), while other blindly defend Spike (because Fire Pro). After spending quite a lot of time with the DLC in recent days (my workshop page serves as proof lol), here's my two cents in a very subjective review. Let me start off by saying that the more I play it, the more I love this DLC.
Before I explain why, let’s get the negatives out of the way (and there are quite a few, be patient!):
* The DLC is clearly overpriced; both in gaming industry standards (in other games we get full expansions for that kind of money ) and in the standard that Spike themselves set in previous DLC (no belts, referees, no story & only 10 wrestlers with only 1 attire each – that is the definition of bare bones).
* The point system given to the edits seems disconnected from previous Fire Pro entries, making the current edits ‘overpowered’ compared to the rest.
Surely, one can say that Spike intended Stardom to be in its own universe, so the ranking system is not related to anything else. I tend to disagree and think that’s just sloppy work. Just like a Football Manager game wouldn’t make the Australian League second division super strong compared to the Premier League (“because they are in completely different leagues and never play with each other”), I would expect Spike to continue its multi year tradition and keep the edit points in the same standard.
* The sloppiness continues with the edits themselves – some parts are clearly off (for example – Kagetsu has one of her body parts in a different tone than the rest of her body) and some logic decisions are questionable (going for strong moves early in the match). Although, to be fair, these issues aren’t common and Spike has a history of making bad logic so in a way this does keep the tradition going :)
With so many cons, why do I like this DLC so much?
Well, one of the things I loved the most about older Fire Pro games was the sense of discovery. I recall playing Super Fire Pro Wrestling X Premium and asking myself – who is that guy in the green trunks that keeps beating everyone with his elbows? That’s how I discovered Mitsuharu Misawa and that’s how I discovered Puroresu. Playing the game and then watching & discovering the wrestler or promotion in real life was a really fun experience for me and then the other way around, watching someone in real life and then making him in Fire Pro.
Playing the game (and by playing I mean editing/creating & simming) and watching wrestling became so synonymous to me that I literally can’t watch a wrestling show if Fire Pro isn’t turned on on another screen and if it’s not, I find myself thinking “how do I make this guy in the game?” or if I already made him, I think “is his moveset accurate?”.
I never cared about STARDOM and probably wouldn’t if not for this DLC. I looked into it a short time before the DLC was released and I was hooked. I can gladly say that to me, this DLC provided that same sense of discovery I experienced with the early Fire Pro games and that alone gives me so much more value than all those negatives I talked about at the start of this review.
Personally, I recreate all official edits anyway and add my own touch and tweaks to them so having points a little higher than I would like is just another thing for me to mess around with while watching the STARDOM 5* Grand Prix in the background :)
This editing & recreation (and later, creation of new stuff) is, in my eyes, as essential and fun part of Fire Pro as the simming itself and I am grateful to Spike for releasing this DLC, giving me that old sense of discovery, inspiration and many hours of fun, while also getting a chance to support my favorite game and women wrestling in the process.
I agree with so much of this. The dlc is way overpriced. It doesn't have as many wrestlers/attires as the jr heavyweight and also lacks a fighting road and that dlc was $15.
But this has been my most inspirational dlc for edit creation. The njpw dlc I just picked up mostly to keep up with the best edits on the workshop. I have used something from at least one of those dlcs on each of my edits. But the stardom dlc was the first one I got already with ideas and knowing I had all kinds of new parts and couple new moves I wanted to use. I instantly gave two of my edits a different new move each and redid the attire for another. The entrance themes are also very good and I have already used about all of them. Now I really want to make a whole roster of female edits using all the new parts. Even though this dlc should have been $10-12, I am perfectly happy having paid $20 for it.
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Post by fignuts on Aug 28, 2019 0:37:03 GMT
I think the whole edit points/logic stuff is a moot point. It’s a very nuanced game, and no matter what spike does there will be plenty of people unhappy with the parameters, because everyone has their own preferences for making edits.
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Post by view619 on Aug 28, 2019 2:34:00 GMT
I think the whole edit points/logic stuff is a moot point. It’s a very nuanced game, and no matter what spike does there will be plenty of people unhappy with the parameters, because everyone has their own preferences for making edits. Not to mention that it's a simple matter to just make a model of the DLC edits and lower the parameters yourself.
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